get into them the better it will suit me. I should like to have every one of them in a public school instead of in a Government school. Q. When the pupil's term is up, which is usually three years, would it not be a good plan to let them go out and work, and cut them off from their school supplies during the time they are out, not letting them come in for their board and clothes, and to lie around the school all day Sunday, going back on Monday morning? I have seen this done in the school where I am. They will go out and come back on Sunday with the excuse that they are sick, when really nothing is the matter with them. Would it not be well to make them go out and stay out during the two months, providing their own clothing and everything they need? A. Yes, if they can earn them. That suggestion is all on the same line along which I have been talking. The Government has, with the best of intentions, pauperized the whole race of Indians. It is our business to try to neutralize this influence and reverse the practice. Q. Are the larger pupils enrolled in a day school to be continued on the roll and counted as in attendance when they are out at work? A. Yes, if it is not done surreptitiously. Be candid with the office, tell us what you are doing, and ask authority. I purpose to carry out these ideas to the fullest extent, and give our teachers the benefit of every child constructively in attendance, if they will simply take charge of the children and see that they get out and work at some gainful occupation. Such outside work is much more valuable than any they could do in the classroom. I shall every time be very glad to give the teacher the credit of having done his or her whole duty if the children are brought to the school, started in the rudiments, and then sent out to places where they can be taught actually to do something for profit. Q. Should the old Indians and their children be educated, and is it to be forced on them? A. Some of the old Indians have learned a thing or two of late years, particularly those who have come into close contact with a school. That is where the day school is doing the great work. It is right under the nose of the old Indian, and after a while he learns to respect it. Of course, there is still, among some of the old Indians, a very great opposition to education, or to what we style education. The old-fashioned Indian wants his child to follow the old Indian ways, and believes they are better for it. We have to put the school proposition on very practical ground with him. First we appeal to his instinct of selfprotection. We say: "The white people are coming into your country, and unless you and your people know the English language and are able to read and write and cipher a little you cannot hold your own against the whites. Now it will do no good for you to say the whites ought not to come--that they ought to stay away and leave you alone-for they are coming, and are here." After we have appealed in that way, if he still resists, we say plainly to him that his children must go to school long enough to learn the simple things, whether he likes it or not. And if he still does not listen to the words of the Government, we send the policeman or the soldier to show him that we mean business. Q. Is there uniformity in the treatment of the different tribes thruout the United States? And how, for instance, does the treatment of the California Indians by the Government differ from that of the more savage tribes? A. A full answer to that question would be pretty complex. The tribes differ, of course, as do different peoples of the Caucasian race, and we have to adopt a variety of methods suited to the respective tribes. We treat an agricultural people like the Hopis, who for many years have been subsisting in a poor way by their own labor, in a very different fashion from that in which we treat the proud and warlike Sioux. The California Indian, in my judgment, is in a better position today than nine-tenths of his brethren in the United States, and he is so because the Government has done less for him. He has been stripped of pretty nearly everything—a blessing in disguise, for by virtue of that he has been obliged to get down and work for a living; and I look to see more Indians of the California tribes saved than of any other group in the United States. Q. I have been very much interested in the outing system, and I should like to ask you this question: Suppose a person comes to a large school to get fifty pupils to work for him, what is the basis of choice by which a superintendent or teacher should choose those fifty? What should lead him in his choice? A. I will tell you what rule I should apply; I should study my children to know who among them would receive most benefit from going out—that is, which ones show some capacity for appreciating the advantages of such a chance to touch elbows with the world. When a child shows a disposition toward progress, he should have the benefit of the outing rather than the one who will simply take a lesson because you require him to, and let it run out of his mind as water runs off a duck's back. It is a mighty good plan, whether you are dealing with children or with adults, to give your help not to the inert, but to those who show some interest in helping themselves. ADDRESS ELMER ELLSWORTH BROWN, COMMISSIONER OF EDUCATION OF THE I am wholly without experience in the matter of Indian education and I shall not try to instruct you on that subject. It is only fair, however, that I should say that I am at this time specially and deeply interested in all that you are doing in the education of the Indian, because of the problems we find in the Bureau of Education in the education of the Indians and Eskimos of Alaska; and I feel sure the Bureau of Education has very much to learn from the Bureau of Indian Affairs with reference to the problems that confront us in Alaska. In some respects they are the same problems that you are facing in the Bureau of Indian Affairs; and in other particulars they are very different, particularly our problem of the education of the Eskimos and the special type of education which is based upon the introduction of the reindeer-the introduction of a new industry, necessitating and intended for a new type of industrial education for those people. Now, you are engaged in various kinds of industrial education among the Indians, and I am sure that for both of these classes of natives which we have to deal with in Alaska we shall learn very much from what you are doing here. And I should add that we shall do our best to accomplish something up that may make some small return for what we shall get from you. there It is possible that I may be able to make some little suggestion of a purely general sort, I cannot say what ought to be done, but that is not what you expect of me. Probably you expect me to make some suggestion as to the bearing of these educational efforts that you and the Bureau of Education are engaged in upon the larger educational problems of the time. There are two ways that occur to me now in which it seems that this education of the Indians and Eskimos has a very important bearing upon the large educational movements of the time. The first of these relationships I would speak of somewhat in this way; repeating what has been said elsewhere, our educational development, our development of elementary education, particularly within the last few years, has shown a peculiar tendency of two types of education of apprenticeship. I think it is fair to expect that these two kinds of education, which are really the commanding types of education and which have gone apart for many centuries, are now to converge and give us a new type of school. I think that in our general education we are working toward the type of schoo! that is different, very different, from the ordinary elementary A B C and arithmetic school of the past, and that the new type of school is but fitting together the best things of the literary school and the best things of the whole apprenticeship system. The school means this—that a man is to be prepared for the skill by the actual doing of things. Now both of these things are needed in a well-developed education—both the apprenticeship and the ideas that shall give to the apprenticeship its value. What you are doing in these things in the Indian schools is teaching us a lesson for all our education; and that brings me to the second way in which I think our general education, and such special education as you have to do with, are coming together. It may be somewhat as follows: We are finding of late that the peculiar types of education which have arisen under special conditions have taught us things that we had overlooked where the conditions were more normal. In some respects the problem of education has been simplified and clarified for us by putting it in the form of the education of a special class. Now, that has happened in a dozen ways of late. Curiously two of the most significant ways in which it has happened have come to us from the state of Alabama. I refer to Tuskegee and Helen Keller. In one year there appeared Booker T. Washington's Up from Slavery, and the Story of Helen Keller's Life, and for the general student of education both of these books were significant-tremendously significant, and stimulating for the work of general education. They showed us some things about the training of the senses under those very difficult conditions that Miss Sullivan had to fight, that we had not seen before. They showed us what we can do to advantage for white people under normal conditions, by showing what the colored man has done under the tremendously accentuated difficulties of the man who is working his way up from slavery. These two things wrote large for us some of the things that we had overlooked in our general education. Now, as I have said, in those things are the finest, the most suggestive relationship, so far as I have studied the question between the work you are doing in the Indian schools and the work of general education with which the Bureau of Education is mainly concerned. The little more that I have to say I should like to say with reference to those two relationships. You are to teach us lessons for general education, because the peculiar conditions of the education of the Indians are throwing out in sharp relief things that would otherwise be overlooked in the education of the normally constituted civilized community. Furthermore, the particular way in which you are to give us help in the improvement of our educational practice, is by showing us how the training of a man to do an actual day's work by doing an actual day's work, is going to fit into and reinforce the traditional instruction of the school. Great stress has been laid upon the work of manual training and the work of agriculture. I may have something to say about these before I get thru, but I should like to turn now to another side of this work of apprenticeship that seems to me of even greater significance for our general education. This other thing that I wish to speak of specially-and I do it with great reserve because I know so little about it—is the manual training, the domestic training, you provide for girls. In some respects, the work you do for girls has larger significance for the making of a sound American civilization among the Indians than anything you can possibly do for the boys. We, in our problem of general education, are faced by the normal conditions of our time. We realize the fact-and if we did not realize the fact all we have to do is to read the morning paper and we would realize it-that a large part of the moral issue of this present day centers in the home. What are our schools, our ordinary schools for white boys and girls going to do to improve these conditions that affect the American home? That, I believe, is one of the most urgent problems of general education in this present time. Now I don't believe that good cooking is going to solve this problem, but I do believe that it will do something towards solving it. As a man, I may say frankly that for me good cooking makes a great difference in the home, and I trust I give good evidence that my wife has cared for that side of the matter. One of the most interesting things that have come to us from Europe of late is the story of what is done by the London school board to teach good housekeeping to the girls of the poorer districts of London. There again we are getting suggestions from abnormal conditions that should teach us lessons for our normal conditions. The accounts that have come to us are not all complete. Some of them are in the form of little notices in such articles, for instance, as that of Mrs. Kelley in a recent number of the Century Magazine; some information has come to us by word of mouth from these teachers that have been visiting us under the arrangements made by Mr. Mosely. What has been done seems to be simply this, that in the neighborhood of some of the large board schools in the more crowded portions of London, houses have been secured that are very much like the ordinary house in which the ordinary life of these people is carried on. And into these houses girls have been sent in classes from the neighboring school to do the ordinary work of cleaning, making beds, cooking, all of the ordinary things that make a house homelike and comfortable and sanitary. Now this one little experiment has appealed to me most strongly. I do not believe that that sort of thing can be carried on for a long time in any neighborhood without having an effect, not only on the health of the homes of that neighborhood, but also upon the sense of the home. And the sense of the home is the thing we want to cultivate. Now you are doing a work for girls of which I get some glimpses here and there. It is, I believe, preparing the girls to make, under the conditions that obtain in the communities, simple, dignified, clean, attractive, American homes; different, undoubtedly, from the home of the East, and that should be so-I should think that the homes of one race ought to be different from the homes of another race. There should be some things that represent the peculiar tastes, the peculiar excellence of that race, whatever it may be-it should encourage those elements of comfort, of neatness, of self-respect, of care for the things that are becoming and tasteful, for those things that go into homes everywhere that there is anything that we Americans would call a home. In so far as you can teach the girls of your Indian schools to make homes of this sort, I think that you are preparing the Indians to resist the bad influences of the white man, and I hope you will help to teach the white man how to do the white man's work. Now this is the most that I have in mind to say at this time. The work in manual training and the work in agriculture is of very great significance to us in general education. At this present time we are finding in the United States a great deal of interest in agricultural education. Do not feel that what you are doing in the way of training for agriculture in the Indian schools is done as a separate and isolated work simply because you are in the Indian schools. You are doing it as a part of the great movement that affects our schools in general. In half a dozen of the states legislation has been had during the last year with reference to agricultural education. The national government has gone on step by step furthering agricultural education. One of the most important steps was taken early in March of this year, when a large addition was made to the endowment of agricultural and industrial colleges in the states and territories, a portion of which may be used in training teachers of agriculture for the lower schools. This provision will have a very great and significant influence on the extension of agricultural education. Now I believe that you will be able to work out important problems in your teaching of agriculture, in your apprenticeship in the work of farming, in your apprenticeship in the care of live stock. I believe that you will be able to teach in your apprenticeship along these lines lessons that will be of use to us in our agricultural work. It is in view of such questions as these that your gathering here is of more than ordinary interest and certainly of an interest that extends far beyond the range of the education of the Indian, which of itself is so fascinating. DEMONSTRATION LESSONS CORRELATING ARITHMETIC AND CARPENTRY PRESENTED WITH A CLASS OF INDIAN PUPILS BY CLARENCE L. GATES, PRINCIPAL TEACHER, SHERMAN INSTITUTE, RIVERSIDE, CAL. I shall try to show briefly the manner in which we correlate the industrial with the literary work at Sherman Institute. This makes both of vital interest to the pupils; it enables them to speak, read, and write intelligently of their work and to perform it understandingly. In this lesson I have chosen the |