nations seeing this, may be inclined to grant us peace on safe and honourable terms; or at the worst, that there may be a principle in this state of resuscitation, that the luz, as the Hebrews speak, may be safe and sound, which if it is, there is no doubt of the body being revived. [The luz is a bone in the body, which being sound, as the Jews believe, the body will rise again.]

After these and various other arguments against the terms of the loan, he said he was willing to believe the noble lord might have been constrained by necessity to receive them; but how did this obligation arise? From the imbecility of the administration, which emboldened the subscribers to threaten to withdraw their support, if every demand was not acceded to. On such a supposition he sympathized heartily with the noble lord, but still more with the people, who must pay for the weakness of their ministers. This much he thought it necessary to say, in order to justify his vote the night before; the first vote he had ever given against a budget. But he thought it his duty to give his negative last night, because he believed that the minister would not have presumed to call upon parliament to sanctify so infamous a bargain, if he had not thought that parliament was arrived at that pitch of corruption, that they would accede to any terms, however scandalously injurious to the public: he wished to convince the minister, that at least with respect to him, he was mistaken.

The first resolution being read a second time, Mr. Hussey moved to leave out so much as related to the raising money by a lottery. After a short conversation, the motion was rejected upon a division by 133 to 80.

Debate on Mr. Byng's Motion for a List of the Subscribers to the Loan.] March 12. Mr. Byng said, that the loan of the present year was so extravagant in its terms, and had been managed by the minister in a way so suspicious and alarming, that it merited the most serious investigation of that House. The extravagantly disadvantageous terms, which the noble lord had made, were notorious; not less notorious were the discontents of the people without doors with the parliament, for having agreed to the report of the committee, by which 9 per cent. was already gained by those who had chosen to

sell out their part of the omnium. The minister's conduct, with regard to the agreement, was bad, but the distribution of the loan was much worse. The loan had not been given with fairness and impartiality to the opulent, natural, and constant money-lenders; but on the contrary, there had been the most profligate partiality in the garbling of the list; the friends of the minister had been favoured with subscriptions to an immense amount; while gentlemen of the most respectable character, who had been subscribers to former loans, and to loans also in which they had been sufferers, had been totally excluded, or had received in no proportion to their applications. But what was a more lamentable evil, this partiality was not guided merely by the bias of friendship, but had its warp, as it tended to gain an influence over the members of that House. Those bankers who had ap plied, and formerly advanced large sums, were either cut off with very small portions, or totally neglected. The minister's favourites experienced a conduct totally the reverse. Mr. Atkinson was reported to have 600,000%. on the list that was sent to the Bank. And he was rightly informed, there was 230,000l. standing in the name of one house; one 30,000l. of which fell to the lot of the house, while the 200,000l. was secured for the members of both Houses. This was a species of traffic that had been practised in former years. It was remarkable that the very list sent to the Bank was a fiction, containing unreal names; it appeared a fair open list, while the transaction was unfair and dark. There were members of parliament who had parts of the loan, but whose names did not appear. If the motions he intended to make were agreed to, he pledged himself to prove this at the bar of the House: and that the most glaring partiality had been shewn all through the business. The list was not sent, sealed up, to the Bank, before the loan was proposed in parliament, as it formerly used to be, there to be opened the day after the report of the committee of ways and means had been agreed to by that House. No: the list was detained at the Treasury. It had not been once garbled and once corrected only, but it had undergone many garb. lings, and many corrections; and even after the loan was known to be so high a premium in the Alley, it was garbled and corrected anew, till reduced to the pre

strous a portion of the loan as 3,300,000/, he had ordered a strict enquiry to be made into what Mr. Atkinson had, and had expressly directed, that it should be searched into, whether Mr. Atkinson had any part of the loan under any other name than his own. He had even put that question to Mr. Atkinson, from whom he had received the most solemn declaration, that he had no share whatever in the loan, but what stood in his own name and that of his house. Indeed if he had, it must be a deception; for it must be in direct opposition to the most positive orders which he had given, that no stock should be held by any man but in his own name; and that no partiality whatever should be shewn to any one. If, notwithstanding these orders, any partiality had been shewn, the person aggrieved would complain, and then the business would come fairly before the House; and as any thing contrary to those orders, must be a deception upon him, so he would be as ready as any man to express his censure of the transaction.

no partiality shewn. No person was permitted to subscribe after the bargain was made, to his knowledge; and the reason why the list was not sent to the Bank till Saturday last, was owing to the very great extent of it. The hon. gentleman had said a great deal about the disproportion of the list: the hon. gentleman must know, that the subscription was not, and ought not to be settled by reductions pro rata; for by allowing such a system, much inconveniency might take place; for if, upon every application, the same rule was observed, and a certain portion was to be given to each, government would run great risk, and when the deposit days came the payments would fall short. Another objection to applying any particular given sum to the business was this; if a man knew he would have a fourth part of what he wrote for, or half of what he wrote for, in that case every application would be either for four times, or for twice as much as the person applying really wanted. As the matter stood now, it was well known that almost every person who applied for part of the loan, wrote for a great deal more than they expected, or were allowed, and therefore no certain mode of reasoning, or of objection, could be built on the single fact, that the sums allowed fell greatly short of the sums applied for. But the hon. gentleman had complained of members of parliament being subscribers; really he knew of no law that made it a crime in members to subscribe. There were in that House several men of great substance, who at all times applied, and had always had their proportion according to the amount of the applications offered, but it did not follow that they always gained by it. Certainly they did not, for three or four years ago they suffered greatly; and with regard to there being any members of that House who had sums in the loan under concealed names, he knew of none such. As to Mr. Atkinson, he was satisfied that he had no such sum as had been mentioned by the hon. gentleman; and though whatever had been given to him was for the whole house of Muir, Son, and Atkinson, yet he was convinced, though he had not looked into the list, that the whole firm had no such sum as 600,000l. It was said that Mr. Atkinson had 200,000l. in the hands of other people. He did not believe a word of it; because, in consequence of one hon. gentleman's having in the course of last week asserted, that Mr. Atkinson had so mon

As to what had been said again of the omnium bearing so high a premium as 9 per cent. he could only say that he thought that a small part of it coming to market thus early, and bearing that price, though it was something surprizing, did not go to the establishment of the position contended for by the hon. gentleman, and by those who had spoken on the subject last week, viz. that the whole loan bore a premium of 9 per cent. and that 900,000%. of the public money was thrown away. Gentlemen must know, that if any large proportion of the omnium were brought into the market, the premium would fall greatly, nay the omnium would be done below par, perhaps at three or four per cent. discount. If however after the deposit was paid, and the matter was settled, the present high premium of 9 per cent. should continue upon it, he was ready to own that he should be extremely sorry, and that he had given much greater advantages than he ought to have given, or than he intended to give. He should, in that case, consider the advance of premium as a bad effect arising from a good cause.-The fact was, he had done his best, and of all the offers that had been made, he had accepted that which was least disadvantageous to the public. He again felt it necessary to advert to the reason of the lists not having been sent to the Bank before the loan was proposed to parliament: it never had, on any occasion, been sent till

after the House had agreed to the report of the committee. As soon as that was over, the list was examined and sent; but gentlemen forgot that in a subscription of such a size as the present, it was not a matter of little time to prepare the list; it took up many, many hours; it was not the work of a day, but of all day and all night, and all day again. With regard to its having been garbled, he denied the accusation; that it had been corrected was surely no crime, but that any alteration had been introduced since the loan had been made known to parliament, was, he was pretty well assured, not founded. The orders he gave, were to receive no letters nor applications for scrip that were not brought before one o'clock on Monday last, at which hour the gentlemen met to settle the terms. The rule of that meeting was to convene the monied men, who had made applications and offers, and to convene the heads of all the great public companies, who usually assisted government with money, but who never made any application previous to that meeting; by these gentlemen so collected, the terms were settled, and it was always usual to expect that the gentlemen who were present were to take a pretty considerable share of the loan among them. As to the idea of forcing open his escrutoire and taking out all private letters and papers, that had any reference to the loan, he flattered himself the House would not think such a measure necessary. If that was to be the case, the House had better take the whole of the business upon themselves in future, and instead of the letters, from persons desirous of becoming subscribers, being directed to the first lord of the Treasury, they should be directed to the clerk of the House, and read at the table. The hon. gentleman had accused him of partiality; it was, he believed, rather extraordinary for one person to charge another with partiality, and then to say, "Give me the key of your bureau and your escrutoire, let me empty all your drawers, look over all your papers, and read every letter I can find, and then I'll tell you whether I can prove my charge or not." Certainly such a mode of applica tion would never be countenanced by that House; and indeed it was altogether unnecessary, because the motion already before the House would shew who were the persons that had scrip, and if any one thought himself aggrieved, as he had already suggested, undoubtedly he would

not be silent upon it, and gentlemen would have an opportunity of bringing the matter forward.

Sir George Savile wished that one side would not hint at facts before they were established in proof, nor the other be so ready to declare that this was so, and that was otherwise. Such conduct was in neither case parliamentary, but he said, that he, from the most compulsive internal evidence, supported the motion; for it was not likely that the desired information could be obtained by any other means: those persons indeed might complain who had not got enough: but there was another set of men who would not complain, but of whom the House would complain, namely, those who got too much; it was necessary therefore to pass this motion, in order to discover where the partiality lay; this could be but by the list called for in the second motion; and if the noble lord should refuse to grant it, it might fairly be said, that he defied his accusers, only because he knew, that as he withheld, so they could not otherwise come at the only evidence which could convict him. As to the private letters in the noble lord's escrutoire, they were written to a minister of state, on the subject of the loan, and consequently ought to have been called public letters by the noble lord. And as he would pay no regard, on the one hand, to suspicions of guilt, or on the other, to assertions of innocence; he desired to have the proofs, and then institute the enquiry.

Mr. Robinson repeated what lord North had said, with regard to the directions given, that the list should be made out fairly and impartially; and declared, that his duty in that. House would not suffer him to see the whole of the business done, but that as far as it had come under his inspection, he could answer for it, that the noble lord's directions had been punctually complied with. He also insisted, that no such sum as 600,000l. had been given to Mr. Atkinson; and he could assure the House, that Mr. A. had solemnly declared to him, that he held not a shilling of the new stock under any borrowed name.

Mr. Byng declared, that it was only by the production of the lists and the papers which he called for, that the House could come at the knowledge of the facts. The noble lord had said that it would be improper to open his bureau, and examine his letters. The noble lord's bureau, in this instance, was the bureau of the public,

should plead that he had rejected the offers of some gentlemen, because perhaps he had thought they were not sufficiently responsible, and admitted others whom he thought more responsible, how was he criminal? For it could not be said that the minister did wrong in exercising a discretion in judging who were responsible men, and who were not; consequently, after the list moved for should be produced, if the motion meant any thing, it meant to prove that the men whom the noble lord had rejected were as responsible, or more responsible, than those whose offers he had accepted. Hence there would arise a necessity of a new act of parliament to enable a committee of the House to institute an enquiry into men's fortunes or circumstances, and to examine witnesses upon oath, and hence the time of the House would be taken up with debates upon the responsibility of men; a business not very properly calculated for discussion within those walls.

liable to the inspection of that House; and as an accomptant, he received no letter in a private capacity. In regard to Mr. Atkinson, there were some circumstances in his knowledge of a very suspicious nature. It was pretty certain that he was in a room at the Treasury by himself, with the list, while many respectable and responsible men had it not in their power to converse with the noble lord on the subject. He firmly believed that Mr. Atkinson was the man who had the whole and sole power of garbling that list; that there had been the utmost injustice and partiality in the business; that his constituents, the merchants, and the great respectable houses in London, had been treated with injustice. Men who had written for 100,000l. had only got 5,000l. while others had got all for which they applied. Mr. Boldero wrote for 100,000l. and got only 6,000l. How was he to prove his charge, if he was denied the means of getting at evidence? He was assured, that members of parliament had a part of the loan under other persons names, and he had been well informed, that a particular gentleman saw in the list his name down for 10,000l. when two members of parliament went and claimed it, declaring it was put down for them.

Mr. Robinson said, that what had been urged respecting Mr. Boldero was erroneous. It was true, that Mr. Boldero had imagined that only 6,000l. were put down to him, but he had sent him a note that morning, stating that it turned out to be the error of a clerk in the Bank, in the omission of a figure, for that on examination of the list he had found that he had 60,000l. As to Mr. Atkinson, he had been consulted about names in the city, of which they were ignorant, lottery-office keepers, taylors, and others, who had applied for scrip; but with regard to what the hon. gentleman had asserted, as to Mr. Atkinson having the list in a room by himself, the fact had never happened, he had neither settled the list, nor had he the list to interfere with at all.

The first motion was agreed to. Mr. Byng then made his second motion.

Sir Richard Sutton said, that the object of the motions could not be attained by them; for if the House should be desirous to know whether stock was held by gentlemen in the names of others, they never could discover this, as they had not the power to examine upon oath; and if to the charge of partiality the noble lord

Mr. Byng replied, that to sift out the private fortunes of individuals, or to take a comparative view of the responsibility of different men, was not at all his object.

Mr. Fox was astonished to find the noble lord opposing motions, to negative which would be more consistent in those who wished the degradation of that House in the eyes of its constituents; for by such a vote, it would be conspicuous, if the public money was voted for a partial purpose, and the only means of refuting the opprobrious imputation, if groundless, derived. The argument adduced by the hon. gentleman was too insignificant to merit an answer; yet he could not help observing upon it, if the House could not, by oath, find out the responsibility of subscribers, no more could the noble lord, when he settled the distribution of his loan: but no such examination was intended; the idea was absurd, and it was plain enough might appear upon the very face of the paper, admitting the truth of what his hon. friend had suggested, that many very responsible gentlemen had offered large subscriptions, and had not been permitted to subscribe at all. The noble lord had asserted his own innocence, as to the matters alleged; but he must beg leave to protest against such evidence. Not in any private or uncivil sense, but in a public, he did not scruple to profess, that here he gave not the least credit to the noble lord's assertion; for he never could believe a man who said, "I am in